Sonic X-treme - Point of View - Info + help required

Discussion in 'Rare and Obscure Gaming' started by jollyroger, Oct 20, 2014.

  1. The Perfect K

    The Perfect K Robust Member

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    Sorry this thread wasn't brought to my attention earlier, but I have a Diamond Edge NV1 card, in a fully working Windows 95 box, I'd be willing to help out in any way possible.
     
  2. Zer0-2k11

    Zer0-2k11 Site Supporter 2012,2013,2014,2015

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    Does it have it's Saturn Controller Board too?
     
  3. The Perfect K

    The Perfect K Robust Member

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    I responded to Andrew75 over at sonic retro about this - the controller board itself is nothing special. The one shipped had some fuses on it, but the thing is basically just an extension of the 9 pins on the NV1 board itself into a bracket shaped like Sega Saturn controller ports. I built my own using a Sega Saturn extension cable running to the board, if anybody would like I could give the pinout, too.

    So, no, I don't have the official controller board, but I do have saturn controllers working on my NV1.

    I'm here at home in front of my Sega PC right now, actually. If Jolly Roger can get me the binaries, I can test it out and hopefully have footage of the game running within a few minutes.

    It's just a happy coincidence I have all this stuff, too. I put it together about a year ago just because I was interested in Sega PC stuff. I have most of the NV1 games, too, although Panzer Dragoon and VF Remix -- the reasons I bought the card in the first place -- elude me.

    A Note about the NV1 - every single NV1 game has a Direct X patch available today, so I'm sure there is a relatively simple way to get this stuff running under direct X. Since JR has access to the source, even if he doesn't want to release it, it might be wise to let someone knowledgable poke around at it and see if they can get it running on a modern system with a modern video card. Modern, of course meaning DX compatible Win 95 release.

    Obviously, just seeing if the original build runs is a top priority.
     
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2014
  4. The Perfect K

    The Perfect K Robust Member

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    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Just waiting... :p
     
  5. jollyroger

    jollyroger Gutsy Member

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    I appreciate your help, but I prefer to have a complete system myself, rather than relying on someone else to run code for me.

    Thanks.

    Jollyroger
     
  6. Kao

    Kao Gutsy Member

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    In the interest of the health of this thread and the initiative it represents, let's all agree to not acknowledge or otherwise respond to the post above.


    Thanks for all your efforts on this project, jollyroger.
     
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2014
  7. The Perfect K

    The Perfect K Robust Member

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    Sent you another PM, just to get it all out in the open, I'm willing to loan you my equipment for free :)
     
  8. nesboy43

    nesboy43 Active Member

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    Glad things are coming into place. Once again just want to thank jollyroger for wanting to share with us.
     
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2014
  9. The Perfect K

    The Perfect K Robust Member

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    Please, this. Unless you have something to contribute, and begging for a proto is not contributing, please let this all just play out. Bugging generous people like Jollyroger is how we lose prototypes in the first place.

    I can understand the logic behind his reply, for those wondering. You're prepping a development environment to try and build 20 year old code, that involves tons of trial and error. Having to do this remotely, sending every single attempted build, to someone online would be an enormous pain in the ass. It would turn a process that could normally take hours into a process that might take months when you factor in time schedules and time zones and all that.

    I don't think he wants to give out the source code in the first place, for the reasons we all know (ofer doesn't want that to happen, as an example.) Best case scenario would be the guy releases the source on his own so we could all coordinate together, but it's his stuff so he gets to make the rules.

    I don't think he doesn't "trust us" but rather what we propose is logistically a nightmare.

    Regardless, I've offered to loan him my card for free, for the benefit of everybody involved in this. I just want some proof from the guy that this is real before I mail off a piece of my collection to a stranger, which isn't unreasonable. I think the guy is going to deliver ultimately :). His PM reply to me was to the effect that the best way to help would be to sell him my NV1 for him to work with, otherwise I'd just have to wait for his planned normal release.

    In short, everyone just chiiiiillllllllll. I know sonic fans have a history of working themselves into a frenzy and scaring people off. Just let this work itself out :)
     
  10. NESticles

    NESticles Rising Member

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    Yeah, I removed it. Let's not scare anyone off.

    I just hope nobody was expecting a ton of imminent info. This will take time. Let's make this a good thread!
     
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2014
  11. jollyroger

    jollyroger Gutsy Member

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    All you said above reflects exactly my position.

    - Setting up the development environment is painful, as tools are spread across the archive and there are several versions of the source code
    - It would take forever to do the prep environment/tweak code/compile/debug process remotely, the only way is for me to have a NV1 here
    - I do not intend to release source code, just following Ofer's stated desire
    - I have no issue trusting people, but it's not a quick process even having the hardware here, I am not going to do it remotely, I don't have time for that

    I appreciate the desire to help and I understand the issue with trusting a stranger (me), which is why at this point in time I am comfortable not asking anyone to part with any piece of their collection.
    Having said that I have no problem showing some form of proof if that contributes to building trust, as long as it doesn't involve giving away pieces of the archive.

    For example I can easily have someone skype me, I can then share my desktop and browse through the archive folders...

    Jollyroger
     
  12. MBMM

    MBMM Powered by Pied Piper

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    Very good post, The Perfect K. Everyone needs to remain patient and keep those words in mind. This thread doesn't need to get flushed through poor behavior.
     
  13. andrew75

    andrew75 Spirited Member

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    In a nutshell, Even with everything acquired, and from my understanding of reading threw the posts. please be patient and expect a long wait time. I'm betting in what JR has, that there may be missing assets , in which case will draw out the re-development time a bit longer than what we all may have originally hoped for. No one can put a time table on a project such as this. It could be months , it could be years. but Knowing JR is a skilled programmer it may not really even take very long.

    In familiarizing myself with the .def files from the last leak. I know that the engine may not be as complex as may be thought.( I'm only assuming this based on how simple the def files are set up.)

    One can look at a .def file to easily see Block definitions for scale, and what textures are applied to the corresponding face side on the blocks. than you can use the .pcx layout files which have colored pixel layouts for the levels and use that as a guide to place models in a 3D modeling package by hand manually after building each block to .def file specification. ( block placement type by pixel color)

    I have a feeling that JR may not have us waiting for a super long time, (at least I don't think it will turn into a years wait for an initial playable release.

    Other thoughts, I do wonder if he will be improving gameplay code and continuing Sonic-xtreme's work in the original intended engine.
     
  14. The Perfect K

    The Perfect K Robust Member

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    Right, with the last leak, you could edit the "levels" with microsoft paint, lol. Considering the rushed development of this engine, that makes sense.
     
  15. jollyroger

    jollyroger Gutsy Member

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    Ok, some help would be nice.

    It turns out STI was using the Cartdev development environment, while POV was using mostly PSYQ. This means I can generally build Saturn code that comes from STI (and eventually run it too on my Cartdev), but I can only build the code from POV, as I don't have a Saturn PSYQ hardware setup.

    Of course I can convert everything to run on the Cartdev, but it seems most of the assembly files POV wrote are written with the PSYQ assembler syntax, which makes it a pain to convert them to SNASM compatible format, not to mention all the makefiles and linker directives.

    I have used SNASM and Cartdev before, but I have never used a PSYQ, so it will take time.

    Cross Products had a CPE2COF tool, which I tried to use but it crashes on these CPE for some reason...

    Anyone has a complete Saturn PSYQ for sale? :)
     
  16. f2bnp

    f2bnp Peppy Member

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    jollyroger, may I suggest opening a Want To Buy thread on the marketplace forum? That way you'll ensure that more people see it.

    Also, to anyone that wants to beg for a release, please think twice before doing that. We are incredibly lucky in that the backups are on the hands on someone that is not only tech savvy, but also a well meaning and polite person. Please don't be a dick.

    [​IMG]
     
  17. jollyroger

    jollyroger Gutsy Member

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    Hi there, I actually do have a WTB thread on the marketplace forum, I will add the PSYQ system to it...

    Cheers,

    Jollyroger

     
  18. RoughRobbert

    RoughRobbert Newly Registered

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    Hey guys, I searched the basement and I have a Diamond Edge 3D NV1 card also.
    Let me know if you could use this.
     
  19. HugoPeters

    HugoPeters Active Member

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    Does it come with the Saturn Controller Board? Otherwise it's probably of no use to jollyroger.
    Also, didn't he already got one from eBay?
     
  20. jollyroger

    jollyroger Gutsy Member

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    I have one in the mail, but if your has the controller port board it would save me the time to build a connector...
     

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