Pseudo Saturn Compatibility Chart

Discussion in 'Sega Saturn Programming and Development' started by zorlon, Aug 20, 2014.

  1. l_oliveira

    l_oliveira Officer at Arms

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    The System disk has different information encoded in it's barcode. Running a copy won't get you anywhere as it's the data in the protection ring which does the real magic.

    Without that protection ring it's nothing but a program which loads an IP block after the system has already booted an application.

    Maybe analyze and use the "system clean boot up state" in the system disc to improve Pseudo compatibility with games ?
     
  2. Omega

    Omega Active Member

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    Yeah I know how it works. :)
    I was just curious about what could happen using both Pseudo and SD. DSwizzy145 asked in the other thread and I don't know why I didn't try it yet.
    Also, I tried to flash the that IP on an ARP+ and although it loads correctly doesn't work at all. Maybe using that kind of approach with Pseudo wouldn't help because that must be read by the CDB directly to unlock it.

    And besides most of us think it's impossible, maybe we can put a burned system disc on a regular original CD just to have the ring.
     
  3. l_oliveira

    l_oliveira Officer at Arms

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    Well the IP doesn't matter in that context. You don't need to execute it. You need to leave the system in the SAME state the system would be if the BIOS were jumping at the GAME IP.I believe that would be one of the reasons for these "compatibility issues" the program is currently having. Another would be how it hooks into the system. A third possibility would be it having impact on how the CDB operate after it has been exploited.
     
  4. A Murder of Crows

    A Murder of Crows Spirited Member

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    somehow this didn't post:

    Hyper Duel works.
     
  5. Omega

    Omega Active Member

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    I've read somewhere (here?) that the SD has that IP as some kind of "password" to use as an unlocking key with the CDB. And there's nothing on the disc, besides the IP. Actually, after "COMPLETED" the ISO is just lots of zeroes. Even the audio tracks are nothing.
    Also the amount of tracks or the time of them could be part of the "password".

    But if it doesn't matter, in theory would it be possible to just open the lid while on that SEGA LICENSE screen using an original game, jump back to the CD player and use a CD-R? With a nanosecond precision... :p

    And since it stays there even after resets, isn't it on the CDB side only and not related with BIOS?
    I never found the exact way that works.

    The problem with those games and Pseudo are probably similar to those on OPL and PS2. The program overlaping low RAM addresses or specific addresses. At least there's no IOP ram garbage on the Saturn and we can always soft reset, hehe.
     
  6. zorlon

    zorlon Spirited Member

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    Thanks for verifying some stuff and pulling out correct names, it can be considered to be annoying being correct at times but end of the day I want accurate information so I for one appreciate it ;)
     
  7. zorlon

    zorlon Spirited Member

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    Thanks again to all contributing to this, done another update to the main list

    If I have missed anything or you notice any errors on my part please let me know so I can correct them


    Please don't forget to include region info even if a game was only released in one region as I don't automatically know this (just saves me looking)
    Also please try and find out what the correct name is for the game (I tend to use GameFAQs as a reference though they can make mistakes at times)
    If a game is not from your region please state so if that game is having issues (as this may be part of the reason)
    If a game has issues please try and be as detailed as possible so I can also give a good description, glitched is not a good way to describe it as that could be anything, I need to know when and how an issue occurs, also I need to know what the exact issue is...

    e.g's for problem reporting
    Froze after hitting start on start screen and hitting open on the drive did not load the Saturn bios
    Froze on boot at Produced by Sega screen and hitting open on the drive did not load the Saturn bios
    This seemed to boot fine but before the game loads I was returned to bios screen
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2014
  8. jrio

    jrio Rising Member

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    I finally had time to go through and correct a lot of erroneous titles in my collection but there are 1268 known Japanese titles, some of which are extremely difficult to figure out and some use the alternative English titles instead of the original.

    Satakore's database does have the proper titles for all the Japanese games.
     
  9. jrio

    jrio Rising Member

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    More updates and a few fixed titles.

    - Aquazone Desktop Life (main disc)(jap) - boots, plays, menus don't have options, gives warning error after registering your name. I do not know how to play this and I even tried one of the options discs. Any help on this one is appreciated.
    - Bomberman Wars (jap) - perfect
    - Dark Seed (jap) - proper burn, still doesn't work. boots sega logo, screen flashes briefly then goes black and leaves 5 white pixels at the bottom
    - Dark Seed II (jap) - perfect
    - Keio Flying Squadron 2 (pal) - 3 notes:
    1.) burned in 50hz native mode, boots, goes all the way to start of gameplay, crashes back to Saturn internal menu
    2.) burned after using SRP in 60hz mode, works perfect
    3.) someone with a native 50hz Saturn and tv should test this in Europe
    - Moon Cradle CD1 (jap) - perfect (this is a 3 CD game, no idea if the other 2 cds work, probably need to be saves and swaps at certain points)
    - Shingata Kururin Pa! (jap) - perfect *properly burned on a new cdr, works great, very fun game :)
    - Those Who Hunt Elves (jap) - perfect
    - Whizz (pal) - works. starts out with a black screen and you can hear music. i kept hitting start and eventually the game went directly to gameplay after about 30 seconds. gameplay worked fine. may try SRP on this one.
    - Yellow Brick Road (jap) - perfect

    I'll be testing all the lightgun games tomorrow aside from Virtua Cop 2 and SCUD which are both working.
     
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2014
  10. l_oliveira

    l_oliveira Officer at Arms

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    Because you go through IP execution when you boot a System Disc, you have to perform operations to put the system back on the same state it need to be to run a IP program again. That's the point of having a program into the System Disc. Also I think the IP on development discs might be different than that of pressed retails. I am not 100% sure about that though.

    Now the parallel of comparing the Saturn System Disc to a PS2 optical disc drive emulator program is surely a *odd* one.

    The problems with Open PS2 Loader are mostly related to inaccuracies of operation on the system driver for the disc drive (CDVDMAN) and the RPC driver (CDVDFSV), the fact that the developers tried to keep memory footprint small, functions were poorly simulated or simply don't return anything at all...

    During boot, the said program catches attempts of IOP reboot and parses the IOP replacement image supplied by the game, replacing the CDVDMAN and CDVDFSV drivers with the ones it use. Also it hooks into system function calls to hijack control of fileIO, reset and execution handles. IGR hijacks gamepad reading code.

    You see, also some games have protections against stuff like Datel's Action Replay or HD Loader and OPL certainly trip these protections on the same way the original programs would.

    Very unrelated with how stuff work here in the Saturn, no ?
     
  11. jrio

    jrio Rising Member

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    Correct. This is the Pseudo Compatibility thread.
     
  12. Omega

    Omega Active Member

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    As I said, I've read somewhere (here or SegaXtreme) that there was no program at all on that disc. And I couldn't find any information about the real process.
    For the odd comparison, I was talking about Pseudo as a game loader, like OPL or ESR and using IGR. Nothing related to the System-Disc.
    The comparison was just because I remember that a lot of games would simply crash the system when you soft reset with IGR. At least I got no problems with that in PSeudo so far.
    It's just a silly comparison from a common person point of view. Of course I can't get the whole technical points of how these stuff work unfortunately.
    Thanks for clarify the PS2 tech things! I hope there's some thread explaining about the System-Disc somewhere. :)

    You've been already warned about this behaviour. And please don't try to say that you don't about it.
    You said you would ignore me and once again you're not taking your promises seriously. And no... you are not talking to any other about any other...
    Do "your kinda thing". ;)
    At least I'm glad to see that you are understanding the point of this thread somehow. Keep it up. ^_^


    Zorlon, Lunar 2 line on chart says it was tested with 0.931 version. My System-Disc(KD02)Columbia (it's the "official" name, based on the original CD case, at least) test was not included on the list.
    And one more for the list: Fighters Megamix (JP) is working.
     
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2014
  13. l_oliveira

    l_oliveira Officer at Arms

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    I dunno if you're aware how the boot work on DISC based SEGA hardware but if a program is small enough it can certainly fit right after the "IP" block.

    MEGA-CD games do that. And they put program there for both the MEGA DRIVE and SUB CPU 68000s on the IP block.

    So, on SEGA discs, the real boot up program is aways on the disc track 0.
     
  14. jrio

    jrio Rising Member

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    Here's the full Sega Saturn lightgun compatibility list. Please keep in mind that for some games you either need the gun plugged in to port 1 or port 2, it depends on the game (see Virtua Cop I). If there isn't sufficient internal memory storage, sometimes you'll need a gamepad to tell the game you don't care and want to play without saves. For most games this wasn't an issue but for House of the Dead it was.

    - Area 51 (usa) - perfect w/ gun in port 1 and gamepad in port 2
    - Chaos Control (pal 60hz) - perfect, unplug pad and plug in gun at game start
    - Crypt Killer (usa) - perfect, unplug pad and plug in the gun at game start
    - Death Crimson (jap) - perfect, unplug pad and plug in the gun at game start
    - Die Hard Trilogy (usa) - game loads fine, gun does not work, only gamepad worked. need to do more testing or have someone else test this.
    - House of the Dead (usa) - game complained about not enough save memory so I had to start with a pad then change to a gun at gameplay, worked fine.
    - Jinzou Ningen Hakaider: Last Judgement (jap) - perfect, can start with the gun in port 1
    - Maximum Force (usa) - perfect, can start with the gun in port 1
    - Mighty Hits (pal 60hz) - perfect, can start with the gun in port 1, really fun game
    - S.C.U.D. (usa) - already reported working fine when you change to gun at gameplay setup
    - Virtua Cop I (usa) - perfect, gun only worked in port 2 with the pad in port 1
    - Virtua Cop II (usa) - already reported working fine
     
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2014
  15. jrio

    jrio Rising Member

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    A few more updates:

    - Assault Suit Leynos 2 (jap) - perfect
    - Battle Garegga (jap) - perfect
    - Don Pachi (jap) - perfect
    - Fire Pro Gaiden Blazing Tornado (jap) - perfect
    - Fire Pro Wrestling S 6 Man scramble (jap) - perfect
    - Hissatsu! (jap) - perfect
    - Kururin Pa (jap) - perfect
    - Last Bronx 2CD (jap) - both cds, perfect
    - Layer Section 2 (jap) - perfect
    - Magical Drop II (jap) - perfect
    - Magical Drop III (jap) - perfect
    - Pretty Fighter X (jap) - perfect
    - Space Invaders (jap) - perfect
    - Super Tempo (jap) - perfect
     
  16. sumone

    sumone Spirited Member

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    Nights into Dreams (JP) Boots fine, plays fine
    Virtua Fighter Remix (JP) Boots to Bios
    Vampire Hunter: Darkstalkers Revenge (JP) Boots fine, plays fine
    Princess Crown (JP) Boots fine, plays fine
    Linkle Liver Story (JP) Boots fine, plays fine
    Wachenröder (JP) Boots fine, plays fine
    Three Dirty Dwarves (US) Boots fine, plays fine
     
  17. Druidic teacher

    Druidic teacher Officer at Arms

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    x
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2017
  18. jrio

    jrio Rising Member

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    Here's an idea. Rather than having the people that have all the Saturn titles test all 1962 games, why don't you guys make a list of titles that could be problematic ahead of time as indicated by Druid in the aforementioned post. Any games that use special hardware or software features should have priority assuming the know-it-alls on here actually know what those titles are.
     
  19. CombatRocked

    CombatRocked Rapidly Rising Member

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    All of these are original retail games.

    Panzer Dragoon (JP) Boots fine
    SF Alpha zero (JP) Boots fine
    Gale Racer (JP) Boots fine
    King The Spirits (JP) Boots fine
    Layer Section [ss collection ver] (JP) Boots fine
    Layer Section 2 (JP) Boots fine
    Blazing Tornado (JP) Boots fine
    Hattrick Hero S (JP) Boots fine
    Daytona USA (JP) Boots fine
    Metal Slug (JP) Boots fine
    Amakusa's Revenge (JP) Boots fine
    KOF 96 (JP) Boots fine (JP) Boots fine
    Elevator Action Returns (JP) Boots fine
    Sword & Sorcery (JP) Boots fine
    Zap Snowboarding Trix (JP) Boots fine
    Shin Shinobiden (JP) Boots fine
    AJPW Feat Virtua (JP) Boots fine
    SDF Macross (JP) Boots fine
    Panzer Dragoon Saga (EU) - boots fine. I can start a new game, watch intro & enter name but then it freezes on a black screen. Access led flashing & rest button is no longer responsive.
     
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2014
  20. hey

    hey Member

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    When I try Skeleton Warriors with Pseudo Saturn, the game crashes at the blue Sega logo. When I try again with the disc swap or system disc, the game gets past the logo. After about 10 seconds a bunch of garbled artifacts appear on the screen and then it crashes.
     

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