PAL SNES 1CHIP: does c-sync exist on the S-RGB chip?

Discussion in 'Modding and Hacking - Consoles and Electronics' started by keropi, Sep 25, 2012.

  1. keropi

    keropi Familiar Face

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    Hiya!

    I am thinking to do the c-sync mod instead of composite for rgb sync on my PAL 1CHIP snes, is it possible from the S-RGB chip? cut the trace to pin9 and patch there c-sync?

    Will this work?

    [​IMG]

    (pic stolen from fireaza's French n64 rgb mod thread here )

    TIA for any info! :triumphant:
     
  2. Bad_Ad84

    Bad_Ad84 The Tick

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    Its there on the snes jr - so probably there on the other 1chip
     
  3. keropi

    keropi Familiar Face

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    allright, it's worth a shot then, thanks again Bad_Ad84 :encouragement:
     
  4. dakooldog

    dakooldog <B>Site Supporter 2013</B><BR>

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    Go for it, report back with results.
     
  5. FireAza

    FireAza Shake! Shake!

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    Oh hey! It's that diagram I made!

    Are you having picture problems that you think using Csync would solve? I have an older SNES and I'm pretty sure doesn't even have the S-RGB A chip, but it's RGB still looks great. Also, wouldn't ccync have been connected to the system since the S-RGB A chip was designed for the SNES instead of being briefly re-used in the case of the N64?
     
  6. Bad_Ad84

    Bad_Ad84 The Tick

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    Csync is connected on pin 3. If your cable doesnt have a connection on pin 3 (almost all dont) you arent using csync. Which is why hes going to cut it like the N64 (and is also WHY you need to do it on the n64. If you had a cable using pin 3 - you wouldnt)
     
  7. keropi

    keropi Familiar Face

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    yep fireaza, your pic is stolen LOL

    Bad_Ad84 is correct as usual, I don't know if it makes any difference but I am using an original PAL SNES cable, so it's composite... I don't think it has pin3 connected too unless I am missing something... I noticed on my SNES that there are some faint jailbars or something in solid color backgrounds (usually blue colored) and thought of trying c-sync) but overall the picture quality is just awesome....
     
  8. Ho-Oh.x7

    Ho-Oh.x7 Member

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    Maybe not the most useful thing to say after the mod is done, but if anyone else is looking at at trying a c-sync mod I recommend considering this.
     
  9. Bad_Ad84

    Bad_Ad84 The Tick

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    Sync stripper doesnt have the same effect.

    The reason csync was used on the N64 was because using composite video gave a X pattern across the screen. Same with a sync stripper. Switching to csync solved it.
     
  10. FireAza

    FireAza Shake! Shake!

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    Oh, I see. So are the any cables that have a connection on pin 3, or did Nintendo make a chip with capability that never gets utilized?
     
  11. bacteria

    bacteria I am the Bacman

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    I've a couple of PAL SNES boards open at the moment, neither have the BA6591AF chip; nor the S-RGB chip mentioned in the first post.

    Does that mean I can't get proper C-Sync from my PAL SNES consoles for RGB?

    Anyone got a pic of the location of the chip, if it is present, I can't see it on my boards!
     
  12. Bad_Ad84

    Bad_Ad84 The Tick

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    should have csync on pin 3 of the multiav
     
  13. reprep

    reprep Gutsy Member

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  14. Bad_Ad84

    Bad_Ad84 The Tick

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    You are right actually, good spot.

    Should not be on the forum when I am in the middle of (modding) other things!

    Just use pin 7 (which is Luma) for sync.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2012
  15. bacteria

    bacteria I am the Bacman

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    Ok, thanks!

    Is that better than using composite for C-Sync?
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2012
  16. reprep

    reprep Gutsy Member

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    What kind of problems you get when you use composite for C-Sync?

    If you are expecting a picture improvement, it won't happen as picture information is only carried on R,G and B pins for RGB video. Pin 20 of scart is only used for video syncing.

    If only you get distorted video and/or blinking etc which are signals of wrong syncing, try c-sync, luminance or sync stripper etc.
     
  17. keropi

    keropi Familiar Face

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    that's almost false, in RGB if you use c-sync instead of composite then you get a BETTER image quality especially in modern lcd panels. Famous systems that benefit from c-sync instead of composite on RGB mode are the SEGA 8 and 16bit consoles, the N64 , the PCE and neogeo (perhaps more but those are the ones I have tested) .
    I have no idea though if SNES benefits from that, I haven't tested it yet.

    edit: and as a matter of fact, here are 2 pics I took:

    RGB/COMPOSITE (notice the pattern on the stones or Alex's hair) :
    [​IMG]


    same machine, cables, tv with RGB/C-SYNC:
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2012
  18. Bad_Ad84

    Bad_Ad84 The Tick

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    Luma works much better than composite on the N64. No different than from csync.

    I cant speak for the snes as I have never done it.
     
  19. reprep

    reprep Gutsy Member

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    Interesting pics. I didn't know using sync from c-sync instead of composite would differ so much. I was too quick to judge.

    But picture 2 is still not perfect. Background sky near the left arm of Alex has bleeding from the grass below.
     
  20. keropi

    keropi Familiar Face

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    ^ yeah the pics are not so great for detail, I got them with my 3MP phone camera... but you get the idea, composite seems to introduce some kind of pattern at the image, which lacks from the c-sync one... it's about the signal levels or something along those lines...
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2012

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