Open Source Xbox Live?

Discussion in 'Xbox (Original console)' started by AlexRMC92, Feb 19, 2013.

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  1. AlexRMC92

    AlexRMC92 Site Supporter 2013

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    I'm not sure spoofing a sign-in will get you very far. The xbox expects a valid session key after logging in, that session key is what the game uses to request services from the title servers. You need enough working auth peices to establish a working KDC at the least.
     
  2. Lukew

    Lukew Rapidly Rising Member

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    Well after a lot of what can only be described as shit, I've moved home, have more space and am slowly becoming a C# ninja.
    Having a read I guess this project is dead as a can of spam, seems to be anyway.

    A thought has sprung to mind though, depends on how much the XDK debugger can be asked to do. TO THE BAT CAVE!
     
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  3. Xbox Loyalists

    Xbox Loyalists Active Member

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    yea kiwi can't get in contact with the new programmers
     
  4. Lukew

    Lukew Rapidly Rising Member

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    If it were me I'd just dump a copy publicly if someone has taken it and buggered off, or at least give enough away to make another version workable. I'm going to do some adventuring in the Debug dash if I can get the XDK debugger to attach to it. Also going to get back to work on making my Xbox development VBox package.
     
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  5. CodeAsm

    CodeAsm ohci_write: Bad offset 30

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    setting up Xqemu and a virtual XP machine isnt realy hard, altho your work might help others. Im not sure if the Debug dash does any special more tricks than a simple game that has live inside
     
  6. Lukew

    Lukew Rapidly Rising Member

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    My thinking is the Debug dash connects to Partnernet instead of the actual Live network, and may miss out some authentication or encryption. Also the debug test connection is a ping rather than a signin attempt I think, and may make it easier to get some form of working connection. After all, that's all Grim has shown, a debug dash pinging a server.

    My virtual machine contains a compilable kernel source with all the tools needed. I *may* look at getting it working with Wine to be used directly with your qemu package on Linux, so with one command you can compile a new kernel and boot it in an emulator :)
     
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  7. CodeAsm

    CodeAsm ohci_write: Bad offset 30

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    Im not saying its imposible, but did you get the kernel you compiled to run? also, the live dash I heard isnt using kernel functions to setup a secure connection. just xnet or something.

    wine? how, what? wine isnt a emulator. its a kernel wrapper for windows applications*

    The debug dash indeed connects to a "different" network, you can set it to partnernet, testnet, or any net you want. probably the network determines the keys used (if none can be used, horray :D) and Im not sure if its just ping, Grim shared the trouble maker to be QoS, packets in certain orders, with a certain timeout that need to be replied on in time with an answer for the challange or something. might be wrong here, but most importantly, what if you strip and patch the kernel and libs, what do games REALY need?
     
  8. Lukew

    Lukew Rapidly Rising Member

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    Got it to compile and play game, networking related things crashed though.

    I meant Wine so that you can compile the kernel under Linux using the Microsoft tools, then launch the compiled kernel under qemu with a single shell script :)
     
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  9. Xbox Loyalists

    Xbox Loyalists Active Member

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    for the sake of planning ahead is the 360 live code and architecture similar to the og Xbox and of course they are similar but differences must not be too drastic as they both are on the same service but if i'm can someone correct me on that
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2017
  10. CodeAsm

    CodeAsm ohci_write: Bad offset 30

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    sources say that earlier Xbox 360 live was very much similiar to the late XBox classic live code. They did know however when a Classic xbox connected or a xenon (just the codename for the 360). they later simply ignored xbox classic signin and could probably patch 360's to call newer servers. so once classic live works, you might need to try an old 360 dash to signin to your homebrew server. I personaly dont know much about the 360 code to tell you how dificult it is to make a 360 believe its connected to live (also, does it have machine accounts and how does the unique 360 ids work in relation to live?)
     
  11. DinohScene

    DinohScene Site Supporter 2014

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    360 doesn't have machine accounts afaik, it can connect to Live without an account to display advertisements.
    It tries to connect to Live and if it doesn't find an active connection, it just displays boxes with "connect to Live" on a retail dash (Metro dash), no clue anymore as for the old Blade dashes.

    360's keyvault is checked server side if it's banned or not.
    I'm not entirely sure as to what they blacklist anymore but any Live related sign-in on a 360 comes back to the 360's KV.

    Someone can probably better explain it then me at 4 am lol.
     
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  12. NCommander

    NCommander Member

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    Somewhat late to this party, but I did read through the thread as I've toyed with the idea of doing this for quite a long time.

    With the hope that some of the folks can correct my understanding, as far as I can tell, Original Xbox authentication is two parts, the Machine Identifier which is used to ident to live, create accounts, and create a chain of trust, and User Authentication, which, AFAIK, no one has deeply documented.

    This corresponds very similar to the stock KRB5 protocol which has system tickets, and user tickets. By specification, when you authenticate against a Kerberos5 domain controller, you need what's known as a session principal, which is essentially a signed message between the KDC and the system to prove who it is (typically stored in something called a keytab). When a user authenticates, the local KRB5 process signs the authentication request with the system keytab (which has said principal), and the KDC returns what's known as a Ticket Granting Ticket, which allows the users to sign their own authentication messages proving identity. Or to sum-up, standard KRB5 auth works like this

    * Machine Enlistment (ME) -> KDC
    * KDC signs the ME and sends it back. This is stored in what is typically known as a keytab
    * User wishes to sign in.
    * User Login is sent to the KDC. Client machine can validated with a signed message from the local keytab.
    * KDC returns TGT
    * User uses TGT to sign a login request to a Title Server
    * Title server can authenticate the user via checking with the KDC, providing end-to-end trust

    Based on my understanding of the thread, the Original Xbox essentially uses the standard KRB5 mechanism to authenticate both the Xbox and the user using hashes of built in serial numbers and such with a non-standard authentication (which part of me wonders if it might just be related to KRB5 variant used in Windows 2000/2003 AD) for the machine authentication part.

    I don't have a XDX or original Xbox any more, but if the Xbox Live routines are in their own XBE, part of me wonders if it would be relatively easier to create a stub XBE that simply "fakes" several steps and jumps ahead to the point where the User TGT would get sent to the title server. I also can't remember if there was much (if any) interaction between games in original XBlive; I vaguely remember it was possible to voice chat and see what friends were up to from the main menu, but I can't remember if you could cross-chat with someone who was in a game and someone who wasn't.
     
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  13. Xbox Loyalists

    Xbox Loyalists Active Member

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    i know this is a bit irrelevant and i may have talked about this before does anyone here know how dreampi works like code and network wise
     
  14. Anthony817

    Anthony817 Dauntless Member

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    All DreamPI is, is the miniaturization of the PC to Dreamcast server. For years and years, people would take full tower PC's and connect a Dreamcast to them through the built in modem on the PC, and running Linux or a VM to run some code to make getting the old dial up signal to work over broadband. Of course this is oversimplifying things, but all that DreamPI is doing is taking that same idea and shrinking it down to a more cohesive package.

    If you want to learn a lot more in depth about the PC-DC server, you can read up here.

    How to connect natively with Linux:
    http://www.dreamcast-talk.com/forum/app.php/page/ryochanpart0

    With a Virtual Machine under Windows:
    http://dreamcast-talk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2427

    And finally with a raspberry Pi:
    http://dreamcast-talk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=8263
     
  15. Xbox Loyalists

    Xbox Loyalists Active Member

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    someone on reddit said that the relive will work on raspberry pi and if so how will it work
     
  16. Anthony817

    Anthony817 Dauntless Member

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    Who on reddit said this? I mean, you would need a computer to run the authentication system and title servers yes, but not sure if we are even close to that point yet. Also, I guess a Pi could handle it possibly, since they have ok specs to run stuff like this.

    The Dreamcast stuff is just basically converting a dial up signal to work on broadband. Analog voice modems and stuff are pretty different to modern broadband signals. Also, many of those Dreamcast games have never completely been offline unlike with Xbox, and unlike the majority of Xbox stuff, all of the Dreamcast games had to have 100% dedicated servers. I mean it would be pretty bad doing P2P with dial up if not damn near impossible to guarantee a smooth game. So I wouldn't exactly equate the stuff going on in the DC community with the same stuff in the Xbox community. Yes it is a similar means to the same end, wanting to get a game console stuff back online doing different stuff to make it happen. This means that each Dreamcast game has to be brought back online on a strictly game by game basis. I guess also in the end the Xbox title servers for each game will be on a game by game basis as well too, but a lot of stuff might be easy to get working and some fixes could be all encompassing potentially.

    But the only reason people are using a Pi to do this is to vastly simplify and mostly automate the procedure, as the tutorials above require you to have a decent understanding of networking and some basic soldering skills as you have to even build a line voltage inducer.

    However, I do own one of those tiny Intel Compute stick Windows 10 PC's and was going to get a USB Lan adapter, and try to turn it into a similar thing to DreamPI to be able to get my Xbox online without having to run a bulky PC or a laptop at the same time. The difference here is I could always keep it on as it only draws 5v of power, and would be using it to connect to Xlink Kai or XBconnect.
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2017
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  17. Xbox Loyalists

    Xbox Loyalists Active Member

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    hey 13 og xbox games are now on xbone for those who don't know
     
  18. rso

    rso Not a member. You're imagining things.

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    that's nice, but a) how's that helping non-xbone-owners getting their stuff online? and b) did they also bring the relevant title servers up again?
     
  19. Xbox Loyalists

    Xbox Loyalists Active Member

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    don't think they did but i think they got xlink working on xbone for crimson skies
     
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2017
  20. Anthony817

    Anthony817 Dauntless Member

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    They said you can physically link all generations of consoles that are running that game. So for instance, say I have Crimson Skies on my OG Xbox, and my friend has it running on his 360, and my bro on his Xbone. We can take and link all the consoles together and play them that way. So it will work over Xlink Kai or XBconnect ect. That is a nice touch I will say. Unfortunately they chose not to revive the original Xbox Live backend. That would have been the ultimate fan service imho. But good on them for at least allowing people to play the games they already own on Xbone.
     
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