NEOGEO EVERDRIVE!!

Discussion in 'Everdrive General' started by dogeymon, Jul 27, 2011.

  1. dogeymon

    dogeymon Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2011
    Messages:
    42
    Likes Received:
    0
    How about it? Any chance of a big, fat, huge, crazy looking NEOGEO rom cartridge?? With a big anime-bug-eyed little dude on the front, and the huge EVERNEO logo?? Haha, that would be cool!
     
    Last edited: Jul 27, 2011
  2. goombakid

    goombakid Spirited Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2010
    Messages:
    169
    Likes Received:
    0
    Here, KRIKzz. Allow me to answer for you.

    [​IMG]

    It's been asked, and it doesn't look like he may make one. Sorry.
     
  3. gtsamour

    gtsamour Rapidly Rising Member

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2011
    Messages:
    82
    Likes Received:
    0
    Actually Krikzz have said that it is almost an impossible task
     
  4. ASSEMbler_archived

    ASSEMbler_archived Pillar of the Community ****

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2004
    Messages:
    19,891
    Likes Received:
    921
    Money speaks. Offer him $15,000 and he'll do it for sure.
     
  5. Den Tarr

    Den Tarr Rising Member

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2011
    Messages:
    51
    Likes Received:
    0
    Im a bit curious:

    What makes it so difficult that nobody develops a flashcart for the neogeo?
    Obviously the market is there. And looking at all those 161-in-1 carts stuffing all the roms together is possible. So where is the problem?

    I know the argument "there are the cheap multicarts so why bother".
    But the multicarts suck. All are always missing great titles and instead are filled up with trainers and hacks nobody wants. And always have a stupid in game reset that cant be disabled.
     
  6. ASSEMbler_archived

    ASSEMbler_archived Pillar of the Community ****

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2004
    Messages:
    19,891
    Likes Received:
    921
    It's simply a pain in the ass with the way neo geo rom is read.
     
  7. r34per

    r34per Rising Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2011
    Messages:
    56
    Likes Received:
    0
    i think a neo geo pocket everdrive would be more feasible
     
  8. sayin999

    sayin999 Officer at Arms

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2004
    Messages:
    3,398
    Likes Received:
    110
    Think about it. You would have to make two pcb boards. That already puts the price up more then a standard everdrive cart that uses 1 pcb. Next you have the chips that are placed in a certain order. By the time you add up all the costs your talking at least a $1000 flash cart.

    I mean the ever drive 64 board is a hell of a lot smaller and its one board and your talking already $100 for that one just bare without a boot chip. There isn't even enough neo geo's and collectors out there to even consider justifying the cost to make one and sell it.
     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2011
  9. Bad_Ad84

    Bad_Ad84 Keyboard Error: Press F1 to Continue

    Joined:
    May 26, 2011
    Messages:
    7,830
    Likes Received:
    778
    I think the $1000 price point is a little "out there". It would be more expensive, but not that much.
     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2011
  10. angelwolf71885

    angelwolf71885 Dauntless Member

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2010
    Messages:
    790
    Likes Received:
    3
    your probably looking at a 300-500 dollar ever drive witch fits right in with the expensive pice of shit the neogeo is
     
  11. Den Tarr

    Den Tarr Rising Member

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2011
    Messages:
    51
    Likes Received:
    0
    @sayin

    Just because you need a second edge connector doesnt mean the PCB has to be that much bigger. And certainly not that the cart has to be much more expensive. It would require a FPGA, a RAM chip and maybe some OS Flashchip. Maybe the FPGA would need to be more powerful but thats it. But even a Xilinx Spartan only costs a few bucks.
    Question is if the FPGA code would be that much more complex. Cant say. I dont know the internals of the Neo Geo well enough. According to Assemler its quite complex. Dont know why.
     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2011
  12. bertobp

    bertobp Rising Member

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2011
    Messages:
    67
    Likes Received:
    0
    Neogeo cart is not a simply memory device is a complex hardware and diferent in every game
     
  13. MottZilla

    MottZilla Guardian of the Forum

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2006
    Messages:
    4,965
    Likes Received:
    74
    FYI, the NeoGeo Multi Carts are only as cheap as they are because the Flash chips used are salvaged from other machines and not bought new. Also, atleast the Multi Cart I have works very well. I've had some minor issues with it. Just because there are hacked versions of games doesn't mean you have to play them. You can get a huge amount of games for very cheap. And they work fine.

    The reason a NeoGeo flash cartridge will not happen, unless as Assembler suggested someone really puts up thousands of dollars for it, is because the NeoGeo carts themselves were expensive.

    There isn't just 1 big ROM chip in a NeoGeo cartridge. There is a 68000 Program ROM (up to 8 Megabytes I think), there is a Z80 Program ROM (256K maybe up to 512K on some games, I can't recall), there is up to 16 Megabytes of Sound ROM Samples, and then up to 64 Megabytes of Graphics ROM data. So that's possibly 4 different simulated ROM areas. You can't use just 1 big RAM chip for that. And the way these areas are decoded may vary from cartridge to cartridge. Not to mention some cartridges have program rom encryption, graphics rom encryption, etc. Sure you could just not support those I guess and require all be pre-decrypted.

    But still the bill of materials is not going to be cheap.
    8 Mbyte Program ROM
    512 Kbyte Z80 Program ROM
    16 Mbyte Sound Samples ROM
    64 Mbyte Graphics ROM

    I'm not sure if there is even any communication between the 68000 and Sound Samples or Graphics Data so you will probably need some hardware for allowing these areas to be loaded or to somehow bank that memory into 68000 space.

    To sum it up it isn't that it can't be done. It's that if it is done it'll cost so much that you won't be complaining that it doesn't exist but that it costs too much. But if you really want it do like Assembler said and offer Krikzz a huge amount of money to do it.
     
  14. Flavor

    Flavor Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2011
    Messages:
    30
    Likes Received:
    2
  15. Calpis

    Calpis Champion of the Forum

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2004
    Messages:
    5,906
    Likes Received:
    19
    Right, the 68000 cannot talk to ANY other bus, so multiple bus arbiters are needed increasing I/O. You can multiplex a few buses together, but not all of them because you'd need to pull off 25ns fetches, even modern RAM is too slow without a caching system.

    Also things nobody has talked about are the Z80 bankswitching, 68000 bankswitching, S ROM multiplexing and S ROM bankswitching. Also if this is supposed to be an AES cart you need tile serialization logic, something few people have been able to figure out, and something nobody has publicly released because it's the key ingredient to a MVS converter.

    The project really is Everdrive 64 x 10. I know, I set out to make an AES RAM cart years ago and I've designed all the hardware pretty much through many many hours of my own reverse engineering and special insight I lucked into. I've barely touched it in a couple years though due to time, money, lack of equipment, lack of high frequency board design skill and more interesting projects. As someone who has gotten half there, I really doubt anyone will be making this any time soon irrespective of the money offered to them.
     
  16. derekb

    derekb Well Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2009
    Messages:
    1,911
    Likes Received:
    20
    Didn't someone state in the neo geo threads that some company used their own homebrewed neogeo flashcarts for a recent release?
     
  17. alphagamer

    alphagamer What is this? *BRRZZ*.. Ouch!

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2008
    Messages:
    3,255
    Likes Received:
    10
    NG:DEV.TEAM http://www.ngdevteam.com/

    They made their own for development purposes, but it is too expensive for mass production.
     
  18. Calpis

    Calpis Champion of the Forum

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2004
    Messages:
    5,906
    Likes Received:
    19
    It's also not nearly compatible with licensed games or fully in-system programmable... Instead of reimplementing SNK chips they designed their own platform which is vastly different; it utilizes a fast MCU or two for *streaming* audio and perhaps as a co-processor.
     
  19. dogeymon

    dogeymon Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2011
    Messages:
    42
    Likes Received:
    0
    Wow so many replies! I guess people at least care about the NEOGEO. I myself don't own one because no matter how I get into it, it seems like it will cost hundreds of dollars. I resent how it was a rich-man's system. Oh well. I suppose a NEOGEO cart is out of the question. Thanks.
     
  20. KRIKzz

    KRIKzz Well Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2010
    Messages:
    1,672
    Likes Received:
    2
    i sure that in some day one neogeo fan will made some solution :)
    probably i would have try to make something if i loved neogeo as i love genesis, but neogeo just a complete zero for me
     
    Krayzar likes this.

Share This Page